| # | User | Message | Date |
| 4282 | Graham | Still eats posts | 9-Jan-10 18:24 |
| 4281 | Pekr | Sunanda - thanks for posting the link, I forgot about those! | 9-Jan-10 9:04 |
| 4280 | Sunanda | 1.2.18 works fine from where I am. Let's hope it is a good sign for the future. Petr, we were asked for our top priorities some years ago....Let's hope too, that those requests are still on the work list: http://www.rebol.org/aga-display-posts.r?post=r3wp151x457 | 9-Jan-10 8:49 |
| 4279 | Graham | wow ... over 1.5 years since last update | 9-Jan-10 6:39 |
| 4278 | Pekr | http://www.altme.com/new.html | 9-Jan-10 6:38 |
| 4277 | Graham | Just filesize limit?? | 9-Jan-10 6:32 |
| 4276 | Graham | What are the improvements?? | 9-Jan-10 6:32 |
| 4275 | Pekr | AltME updated to 1.2.18 .... you can now eg. set filesize transfer limit. Changelog states, AltME is going to be updated regularly now again. Maybe time to submit the most usefull proposal - add button to "mark everything read" (de-red button :-) | 9-Jan-10 6:22 |
| 4274 | Paul | Thanks Graham. | 7-Jan-10 2:17 |
| 4273 | Graham | Done. | 7-Jan-10 1:51 |
| 4272 | Paul | Can someone please create an opportunity group again so I can post an opportunity. | 7-Jan-10 1:46 |
| 4271 | Graham | Seen similar issues before too | 4-Jan-10 19:14 |
| 4270 | Gregg | I forgot to post this. Yesterday, I got the following error message when disconnecting from this world: Server reported error in unknown-request because of: Ýtatus Yes, that first char in the last word is what it displayed. | 4-Jan-10 19:08 |
| 4269 | Sunanda | Pavel -- there's been some difficulties with some groups. Reichart is looking in to it. See [PrivateGroupsDiscussion] for a lot of commentary on the issues. | 3-Jan-10 13:16 |
| 4268 | Will | ok, that is a AltMe bug on OSX, when clicking the green button in the window title bar to max the window, prefs/window/maxed get set to true, clicking again won't update that variable. | 3-Jan-10 11:57 |
| 4267 | Oldes | Pavel: I see it, but it's empty. | 3-Jan-10 11:44 |
| 4266 | Will | I just deleted the prefs/window and all is well | 3-Jan-10 11:43 |
| 4265 | Will | found it.. in prefs/window , change: maxed: true to: maxed: none | 3-Jan-10 11:42 |
| 4264 | Pavel | Group !Rebol3 is not visible for me (dissappeared) anybody else? | 3-Jan-10 11:32 |
| 4263 | Henrik | This is an old bug. Can't remember how to fix it, though... | 3-Jan-10 11:30 |
| 4262 | Will | has there been a silent upgrade to AltMe lately? since a week or two, when opening AltMe, its window will resize fullscreen and no way to resize it, it will keep resizing fullscreen.. OSX10.6.2 AltMe 1.2.17 | 3-Jan-10 11:08 |
| 4261 | Paul | Would be cool if this message window also had a console like feature where I could use it to do some functions like a calculator or other limited functionality. | 2-Jan-10 23:29 |
| 4260 | Graham | It's been like this intermittently for the last couple of days ... | 30-Dec-09 0:51 |
| 4259 | Henrik | It's totally stable here now. | 29-Dec-09 23:52 |
| 4258 | amacleod | less 'internet busy' and more just real slow and no updates of worlds until clicked on. | 29-Dec-09 23:40 |
| 4257 | amacleod | its real bad this time...and a little different than previous slowdowns.. | 29-Dec-09 23:37 |
| 4256 | Henrik | We've seen this before. Usually it suddenly stops if Carl reboots the server or if the network reasserts itself. In the meantime we'll have to live with it for the 1-2 days it usually lasts. | 29-Dec-09 22:38 |
| 4255 | joannak | Based on messages on Advocacy I would estimate that the problems started at 19:50 (+- 2 minutes) GMT, that´s almost 2 hours ago from the moment I´m writing this. | 29-Dec-09 21:46 |
| 4254 | joannak | Yep.. has been some time today. Busy, doing some update, Busy, losing some posts.. | 29-Dec-09 21:34 |
| 4253 | Henrik | AltME running like crap right now. | 29-Dec-09 21:27 |
| 4252 | Henrik | Unfortunately no. It's a much requested feature. | 29-Dec-09 12:12 |
| 4251 | Endo | in AltME I mean. | 29-Dec-09 12:09 |
| 4250 | Endo | is there a way to "mark all messages as read" in a list? | 29-Dec-09 12:08 |
| 4249 | amacleod | Good to know, thanks | 29-Dec-09 1:10 |
| 4248 | Pekr | but if you start it from the panel, it should be OK .... | 29-Dec-09 1:09 |
| 4247 | Pekr | exactly ... but as we know, it is not automatic. You MIGHT loose it, if you don't start it at least once in 10 days (imo even in -s mode) | 29-Dec-09 1:09 |
| 4246 | amacleod | pink > ping | 29-Dec-09 1:08 |
| 4245 | amacleod | So let me get this clear in my head as I have the same problem with losing world names...if I start a world from the altme start console and leave it running it will be fine but if I start it with -s (as I do in a shortcut icon in my 'startup' programs menu (incase of a reboot) I will loose the world in 10 days as it is in server mode and does not pink safeworlds? | 29-Dec-09 1:07 |
| 4244 | Pekr | 2:00 am here ... now before I go to sleep, I need some good news, e.g. when: host kit will allow View (merge of DELECT and commands), Extensions will allow Devices / Callbacks, and when are we back to VID? :-) - so that we can start porting R3 to WM and Android :-) | 29-Dec-09 1:02 |
| 4243 | Graham | so paying the sum fixes it ... | 29-Dec-09 1:02 |
| 4242 | Carl | Yes, docs must be updated. | 29-Dec-09 1:01 |
| 4241 | Carl | So... very interesting. At least now we know the source of the problem.. | 29-Dec-09 1:00 |
| 4240 | Pekr | I think that then docs should be corrected - few sentences would explain it clearly enough ... | 29-Dec-09 1:00 |
| 4239 | Carl | When running AltME with -s, it runs like AltServe.... which never has to ping, because all AltServe worlds have permanently registered names. | 29-Dec-09 0:59 |
| 4238 | Pekr | oh my ... what a logic. If I knew it, I would either buy world names, or just run it the manual way. It surely was not obvious to me, but imo is not obvious to most users too ... | 29-Dec-09 0:59 |
| 4237 | Carl | Ah... I know. | 29-Dec-09 0:58 |
| 4236 | Pekr | The question now is, why doesn't it "ping", when started from .cmd | 29-Dec-09 0:57 |
| 4235 | Carl | Yes, and that statement is true -- when world is started from AltME control panel. | 29-Dec-09 0:57 |
| 4234 | Pekr | hmm, so now I understand it. I have to restart world at least once in 10 days, or it might loose registration? But my condition of "keep it running all the time" is met. | 29-Dec-09 0:57 |
| 4233 | Pekr | You must start your world at least every 10 days (or keep it running all the time), or you will lose your world name. If that happens, nobody will be able to connect to your world, and someone else can take your world name. You can keep your world safe for a small fee. | 29-Dec-09 0:56 |
| 4232 | Carl | I think the big problem is that for users it creates a mystery problem, that just looks bad. | 29-Dec-09 0:56 |
| 4231 | Carl | Ok, I will bring up this problem and it can be discussed. | 29-Dec-09 0:55 |
| 4230 | Pekr | Docs state, that world, if not used for 10 days, is freed. But it is not the case. The world is randomly freed even during its usage. The service is unreliable this way ... | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4229 | Carl | I think the docs indicate script startup of free clients, not "free" servers. | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4228 | Pekr | yes, but it contradicts docs. | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4227 | Carl | Yes. | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4226 | Graham | LOL | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4225 | Graham | It's a feature .. not a bug | 29-Dec-09 0:54 |
| 4224 | Pekr | ok, I restarted it "the old way". I wanted to have it in .cmd, to auto-start servers, when machine reboots ... | 29-Dec-09 0:53 |
| 4223 | Carl | Safeworlds did not want to see people using or reselling AltME free product as a server. So, it does not initialize properly when used that way. | 29-Dec-09 0:53 |
| 4222 | Pekr | "designed"? :-) | 29-Dec-09 0:53 |
| 4221 | Carl | I think this was designed to sell AltServe products. | 29-Dec-09 0:52 |
| 4220 | Pekr | so should I not start it via "start"? That sounds strange ... will turn the world off, and once again with old method ... | 29-Dec-09 0:52 |
| 4219 | Pekr | hmm .... | 29-Dec-09 0:51 |
| 4218 | Carl | ping success! command 28-Dec-2009/16:49:20-8:00 [193.85.151.2 {cmd: open data: ["vertuzo" 0]}] command 28-Dec-2009/16:50:27-8:00 [193.85.151.2 {cmd: live data: ["vertuzo" 64#{kDj | 29-Dec-09 0:51 |
| 4217 | Pekr | start 29-Dec-2009/1:49:19+1:00 ["vertuzo" 5401 1.2.18 29-Dec-2009/1:49:19+1:00] wns 29-Dec-2009/1:49:19+1:00 ["open" "vertuzo" 5401] wns 29-Dec-2009/1:49:20+1:00 ["close" "vertuzo" lookup ok] | 29-Dec-09 0:50 |
| 4216 | Carl | try starting it from the altme "Start a World" panel | 29-Dec-09 0:46 |
| 4215 | Pekr | I start it from Total Commander, running altme-vertuzo.cmd: start altme.exe -s "Vertuzo" -p 5401 | 29-Dec-09 0:45 |
| 4214 | Pekr | debub file: ; AltME Debugging and Logging Options debug: 0 file: %log.txt events: [boot error note start halt wns wns-ping] echo: none net: none time: none | 29-Dec-09 0:44 |
| 4213 | Carl | also, how do you start the world? (from an AltME or from an icon?) | 29-Dec-09 0:44 |
| 4212 | Pekr | above content, only two lines - I deled it .... | 29-Dec-09 0:44 |
| 4211 | Carl | what shows in the vertuzo/debug file? | 29-Dec-09 0:43 |
| 4210 | Carl | yes... but I am concerned because I started a new world here to confirm the debug settings, and it worked. | 29-Dec-09 0:42 |
| 4209 | Pekr | at least the version number is now 18 | 29-Dec-09 0:42 |
| 4208 | Pekr | still the same: halt 29-Dec-2009/1:40:49+1:00 ["halted"] start 29-Dec-2009/1:40:54+1:00 ["vertuzo" 5401 1.2.18 29-Dec-2009/1:40:54+1:00] | 29-Dec-09 0:41 |
| 4207 | Pekr | I will delete the log | 29-Dec-09 0:40 |
| 4206 | Pekr | yes, the same location as debug file itself ... | 29-Dec-09 0:40 |
| 4205 | Carl | verify that log.txt is from altme/servers/vertuzo | 29-Dec-09 0:38 |
| 4204 | Pekr | still no detailed debug info ... | 29-Dec-09 0:37 |
| 4203 | Pekr | start 29-Dec-2009/1:36:39+1:00 ["vertuzo" 5401 1.2.18 29-Dec-2009/1:36:39+1:00] | 29-Dec-09 0:37 |
| 4202 | Carl | stop all altme and servers, then install that new one. | 29-Dec-09 0:34 |
| 4201 | Carl | www.altme.com/download/altme-18beta.exe | 29-Dec-09 0:34 |
| 4200 | Pekr | ok .... | 29-Dec-09 0:31 |
| 4199 | Carl | Let me upload a .18 version for you to try. | 29-Dec-09 0:31 |
| 4198 | Carl | checking... | 29-Dec-09 0:27 |
| 4197 | Pekr | start 29-Dec-2009/1:25:05+1:00 ["vertuzo" 5401 1.2.13 29-Dec-2009/1:25:05+1:00] | 29-Dec-09 0:26 |
| 4196 | Pekr | the same .exe size. The same version, the same behaviour, no logging ... | 29-Dec-09 0:26 |
| 4195 | Carl | brb | 29-Dec-09 0:22 |
| 4194 | Carl | Try it. | 29-Dec-09 0:21 |
| 4193 | Pekr | website shows 1.2.15, is that correct? | 29-Dec-09 0:20 |
| 4192 | Carl | Download 1.2.18, and try again. This will tell us. | 29-Dec-09 0:19 |
| 4191 | Carl | Maybe the bug is that the server does not apply the recent patches. | 29-Dec-09 0:18 |
| 4190 | Carl | so, version number is different. | 29-Dec-09 0:17 |
| 4189 | Carl | my log.txt shows: start 28-Dec-2009/16:12:29-8:00 ["testtest" 5400 1.2.18 28-Dec-2009/16:12:29-8:00] | 29-Dec-09 0:17 |
| 4188 | Carl | Ah... very interesting... | 29-Dec-09 0:17 |
| 4187 | Pekr | log.txt shows no more detail though ... | 29-Dec-09 0:15 |
| 4186 | Carl | So, this indicates that it works (from here). | 29-Dec-09 0:15 |
| 4185 | Pekr | start 29-Dec-2009/1:12:59+1:00 ["vertuzo" 5401 1.2.13 29-Dec-2009/1:12:59+1:00] | 29-Dec-09 0:15 |
| 4184 | Carl | WNS log shows: command 28-Dec-2009/16:12:30-8:00 [75.101.29.32 {cmd: open data: ["testtest" 0]}] command 28-Dec-2009/16:13:31-8:00 [75.101.29.32 {cmd: live data: ["testtest" 64#{OD...}]}] | 29-Dec-09 0:15 |
| 4183 | Pekr | debug rewritten, good sign ... | 29-Dec-09 0:14 |
| 4182 | Carl | log.txt shows: ... wns 28-Dec-2009/16:12:29-8:00 ["open" "testtest" 5400] wns 28-Dec-2009/16:12:31-8:00 ["close" "testtest" lookup ok] wns-ping 28-Dec-2009/16:13:31-8:00 [open] wns-ping 28-Dec-2009/16:13:31-8:00 [lookup] | 29-Dec-09 0:13 |
| 4181 | Carl | After startup, debug file is: ; AltME Debugging and Logging Options debug: 0 file: %log.txt events: [boot error note start halt wns wns-ping] echo: none net: none time: none | 29-Dec-09 0:12 |
| 4180 | Carl | btw, remove the debug file from your other dir, or your clients may log too much info | 29-Dec-09 0:11 |
| 4179 | Carl | move your debug file to the altme/servers/vertuzo directory, then restart the world | 29-Dec-09 0:11 |
| 4178 | Carl | ok, my mistake. Servers don't use the normal client prefs. Here are the steps... | 29-Dec-09 0:10 |
| 4177 | Carl | verifying, 1 min | 29-Dec-09 0:06 |
| 4176 | Pekr | is that correct? Then I restarted one world - Vertuzo, port 5401 | 29-Dec-09 0:05 |
| 4175 | Pekr | altme/prefs/debug (no suffix), added following line: events: [boot error note start halt wns wns-ping] | 29-Dec-09 0:05 |
| 4174 | Pekr | nothing logged ... | 29-Dec-09 0:04 |
| 4173 | Carl | look for line that begins with wns | 29-Dec-09 0:04 |
| 4172 | Carl | yes | 29-Dec-09 0:03 |
| 4171 | Pekr | servers/vertuzo/log.txt? | 29-Dec-09 0:03 |
| 4170 | Pekr | btw - debug file did not change ... | 29-Dec-09 0:02 |
| 4169 | Carl | look at log file. | 29-Dec-09 0:02 |
| 4168 | Pekr | I try to look at netstat -an on that machine, but nothing obvious .... | 29-Dec-09 0:02 |
| 4167 | Carl | It's 5500 as documented. | 29-Dec-09 0:01 |
| 4166 | Carl | wait... nevermind. That's for an experimental build. | 29-Dec-09 0:01 |
| 4165 | Carl | yes. | 29-Dec-09 0:00 |
| 4164 | Pekr | outgoing port 5502? | 28-Dec-09 23:59 |
| 4163 | Carl | The log does not show that the world started. So, there is a problem on port 5502. | 28-Dec-09 23:58 |
| 4162 | Carl | I wonder how that is possible? | 28-Dec-09 23:58 |
| 4161 | Pekr | I can connect from remote client | 28-Dec-09 23:56 |
| 4160 | Pekr | yes, it is ... | 28-Dec-09 23:56 |
| 4159 | Carl | is it running? | 28-Dec-09 23:56 |
| 4158 | Pekr | sorry, vertuzo is 5401 | 28-Dec-09 23:55 |
| 4157 | Pekr | done - world Vertuzo restarted, Xidys runs the old way. Vertuzo runs on port 5402 | 28-Dec-09 23:53 |
| 4156 | Carl | correct, remove that line. | 28-Dec-09 23:50 |
| 4155 | Carl | btw, altme will notice the debug file, and rewrite it with all debug fields | 28-Dec-09 23:50 |
| 4154 | Pekr | so should I delete the debug line from prefs.txt? | 28-Dec-09 23:50 |
| 4153 | Carl | restart just one server | 28-Dec-09 23:49 |
| 4152 | Carl | actually, it's: altme/prefs/debug (no suffix, but as a text file)
Then, in that file: events: [boot error ... above list ] | 28-Dec-09 23:49 |
| 4151 | Pekr | should I restart my servers? | 28-Dec-09 23:49 |
| 4150 | Carl | server... but, wait a min... | 28-Dec-09 23:48 |
| 4149 | Pekr | on my client, or the server? | 28-Dec-09 23:47 |
| 4148 | Carl | in altme/prefs/prefs.txt, add the line: debug: [events: [boot error note start halt wns wns-ping]] | 28-Dec-09 23:47 |
| 4147 | Carl | 1 min | 28-Dec-09 23:43 |
| 4146 | Pekr | the beacon - should be done by my client, or my server? I mean - I could install Wireshark, and filter for packets on port 5500, to see, if it "pings" | 28-Dec-09 23:41 |
| 4145 | Pekr | how do I add it? | 28-Dec-09 23:38 |
| 4144 | Carl | Ah... good idea. In the log config, add wns-ping monitoring. | 28-Dec-09 23:35 |
| 4143 | Pekr | In the client log, I can see sometimes - wns 26-Oct-2009/9:28:23+1:00 ["find" "Vertuzo" lookup expired] | 28-Dec-09 23:34 |
| 4142 | Pekr | I also always wondered, why proxy does not work, if we have it available :-) (but that's different topic) | 28-Dec-09 23:34 |
| 4141 | Pekr | well, you might be lucky, because most of networks don't block outgoing connections ... but those who do, will not be able to get to the network. | 28-Dec-09 23:33 |
| 4140 | Carl | That is a suprise to me.... I thought it was 5500. | 28-Dec-09 23:30 |
| 4139 | Pekr | so, how could it "not to ping" actually? | 28-Dec-09 23:29 |
| 4138 | Carl | BTW, the port is 5502, not 5500. | 28-Dec-09 23:29 |
| 4137 | Carl | Ok, correct. | 28-Dec-09 23:28 |
| 4136 | Carl | Yes, live ping is just altme packet indicating server is running. | 28-Dec-09 23:28 |
| 4135 | Pekr | 208.127.222.200 | 28-Dec-09 23:28 |
| 4134 | Carl | Try this in REBOL: read dns://wns.altme.com | 28-Dec-09 23:27 |
| 4133 | Pekr | any special ping or behaviour for - live ping? I hope not ... can't imagine how it could be blocked here .... | 28-Dec-09 23:26 |
| 4132 | Pekr | What does it mean - live ping? Is it Altme communication type of message? | 28-Dec-09 23:26 |
| 4131 | Carl | That means you have the exe .13, but patches to .17 -- that is fine. | 28-Dec-09 23:25 |
| 4130 | Carl | Most of the log contains live pings... millions of them.... but not from you. | 28-Dec-09 23:25 |
| 4129 | Pekr | Hmm, on server I seem to use 1.2(13) - info on splash screen, but then client shows 1.2.17 | 28-Dec-09 23:25 |
| 4128 | Carl | What concerns me is that I CAN see your cmd: open -- which is your world startup. But, there are no cmd: live pings. | 28-Dec-09 23:24 |
| 4127 | Carl | Well... keep in mind that on your local network, it's a different IP. 10.3.0.88 it appears. | 28-Dec-09 23:23 |
| 4126 | Pekr | If it is not related, I would let it go, I never ever saw it once again. Not so worlds outages. Strange you can't see my IP logged? | 28-Dec-09 23:23 |
| 4125 | Pekr | Well, as I said, it just happened once. Me, nor my friend on their computers were able to connect. The situation was strange, as altme.com/check could see worlds both registered, and online ... | 28-Dec-09 23:22 |
| 4124 | Pekr | IIRC I selected "Follow TCP packet" in WireShark, maybe it could do some conversions, dunno. Then I did cut and copy ... | 28-Dec-09 23:21 |
| 4123 | Carl | That packet is not correct. "].cmd" ? | 28-Dec-09 23:21 |
| 4122 | Pekr | no, no edit IIRC | 28-Dec-09 23:20 |
| 4121 | Pekr | anyway ... some food for thoughts. If you need any assistance, or anything special I could install on my side, I can help. Other tha that, not sure if you want to lose more of your time with it ... | 28-Dec-09 23:20 |
| 4120 | Carl | In the TCP packet above, did you edit that text? | 28-Dec-09 23:20 |
| 4119 | Pekr | but maybe it was a client problem, don't know. I had to let my worlds to expire and re-register ... | 28-Dec-09 23:19 |
| 4118 | Pekr | maybe it is somehow related ... | 28-Dec-09 23:18 |
| 4117 | Pekr | Submitted: 23-Oct-2009/8:52:48-7:00 | 28-Dec-09 23:18 |
| 4116 | Pekr | Carl - and here's what happened, but just once. I sent it to feedback - very special case: Hi, after last outage, I am not able to connect to my worlds - Xidys, Vertuzo. The client even does not try to connect, as I can't see any outgoing packets to IP of my world on particular port (Xidys:5402). AltME client says - "Xidys exists, but not-online". But - our worlds are online. When I go to altme.com/check.html, the world seems to be online, and the site also is able to connect to it. So I inspected TCP packets in Wireshark, and it states: "cmd: find data: ["Xidys" 0 1.2.17.3.1 4811897].cmd: lookup data: inactive ." | 28-Dec-09 23:18 |
| 4115 | Carl | And, yes it is true... we rebooted the server recently -- the reason your world was "sweeped". | 28-Dec-09 23:17 |
| 4114 | Carl | Well, does not work like that. The log records the "raw" commands. So, it shows right now many hundreds of altme worlds "pinging" that they are "live". The fact that your world never shows "live" is a mystery. | 28-Dec-09 23:15 |
| 4113 | Pekr | Maybe you check logs, and maybe when you reboot server, you loose the logs? Because - more users reported at the same time the same problem. | 28-Dec-09 23:13 |
| 4112 | Pekr | Could you post a script/logic, which decides, if the world is or is not online for 10 days? | 28-Dec-09 23:12 |
| 4111 | Pekr | That was also my motivation to not pay for the world names - yet. To find out, what's going on ... | 28-Dec-09 23:12 |
| 4110 | Carl | I could make your world as permanent... but then, I'd not know about this possible bug. | 28-Dec-09 23:11 |
| 4109 | Carl | exactly... | 28-Dec-09 23:11 |
| 4108 | Pekr | I am able to re-register my worlds in 10 minutes, no problem. But it would be nice, if our effort would lead to fix of some possible problem .... | 28-Dec-09 23:11 |
| 4107 | Pekr | maybe, I would have to search this group for my complaints :-) | 28-Dec-09 23:09 |
| 4106 | Carl | and 26-Oct | 28-Dec-09 23:09 |
| 4105 | Pekr | around 11-Nov there was my other outage ... | 28-Dec-09 23:07 |
| 4104 | Carl | scanning older logs... 1 min. | 28-Dec-09 23:05 |
| 4103 | Pekr | the strange "outage" happened 4-6 times in last 6 months ... | 28-Dec-09 23:02 |
| 4102 | Pekr | yes, that is my public IP, and that is IP my worlds are registered to ... | 28-Dec-09 23:02 |
| 4101 | Carl | 193.85.151.2 | 28-Dec-09 23:01 |
| 4100 | Carl | ah, that's when you checked it from the website. | 28-Dec-09 23:00 |
| 4099 | Carl | wait a min.... 208.... | 28-Dec-09 23:00 |
| 4098 | Pekr | our Xidys wifi network has C subnet of 193.85.151.* | 28-Dec-09 22:59 |
| 4097 | Pekr | 212 is walmark - when I access it from my work | 28-Dec-09 22:58 |
| 4096 | Carl | 208.127.222.200 | 28-Dec-09 22:57 |
| 4095 | Carl | 212.71.148.228 | 28-Dec-09 22:57 |
| 4094 | Carl | I was wondering about that. | 28-Dec-09 22:56 |
| 4093 | Pekr | I mean - being NATted to different public address ... | 28-Dec-09 22:56 |
| 4092 | Carl | ah | 28-Dec-09 22:56 |
| 4091 | Pekr | so actually it might come out from different public address ... | 28-Dec-09 22:56 |
| 4090 | Pekr | My brother put public IPs also on some subsequent routers. | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4089 | Carl | yes | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4088 | Graham | maybe your firewall is blocking this heartbeat ? | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4087 | Pekr | Carl - can you see any 193.85.151.* IP in there? | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4086 | Pekr | wait a minute, maybe I have to kill someone :-) | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4085 | Graham | safeworlds is not contacting you ... | 28-Dec-09 22:55 |
| 4084 | Graham | Pekr, you don't understand | 28-Dec-09 22:54 |
| 4083 | Pekr | Graham - if port 5500 would not work, I think that altme name translation would not work ... | 28-Dec-09 22:54 |
| 4082 | Carl | What I said above was that if I grep the log, I do not see a "live" message from your server. | 28-Dec-09 22:54 |
| 4081 | Pekr | Well, then everything is ok on my side. So why you are saying that you can't ping Xidys? | 28-Dec-09 22:53 |
| 4080 | Pekr | Graham - doing what? ;-) My worlds are running, clients connected, so yes, my world is doing it :-) | 28-Dec-09 22:53 |
| 4079 | Graham | Xidys Altme server -- ( every 5 mins ) ---> safeworlds:5500 | 28-Dec-09 22:53 |
| 4078 | Carl | You do not need 5500 inbound. Only outbound. | 28-Dec-09 22:53 |
| 4077 | Pekr | Or you need 5500 port being accessible to your server? | 28-Dec-09 22:53 |
| 4076 | Graham | so does wireshark show that your altme sever is doing this?? | 28-Dec-09 22:52 |
| 4075 | Pekr | ping to public IP? Should work. | 28-Dec-09 22:52 |
| 4074 | Pekr | Carl - to proceed - you said you can't ping Xidys ... what does it mean? | 28-Dec-09 22:52 |
| 4073 | Pekr | hmm, maybe even the name, but it does not matter ... | 28-Dec-09 22:52 |
| 4072 | Carl | Yes, it sends world name and a hash key to authenticate your claim. | 28-Dec-09 22:52 |
| 4071 | Pekr | Graham - no, wrong - the "ping" is sending IP and port ... | 28-Dec-09 22:51 |
| 4070 | Pekr | Or you need DST NAT 5500 back to my world servers? | 28-Dec-09 22:51 |
| 4069 | Graham | But if you run more than one world on the same IP address .. the "ping" must be also sending the world name | 28-Dec-09 22:51 |
| 4068 | Pekr | Normal ping to public (registered/sent) IP adress? | 28-Dec-09 22:51 |
| 4067 | Pekr | So just tell me, what your "ping" means ... | 28-Dec-09 22:50 |
| 4066 | Graham | It's a heartbeart every 5 mins | 28-Dec-09 22:50 |
| 4065 | Pekr | If I am online with 2 worlds right now, being connected to Xidys now = ports are OK | 28-Dec-09 22:50 |
| 4064 | Carl | This is also used to "lock" the world name from reuse. | 28-Dec-09 22:50 |
| 4063 | Carl | This also allows dynamic IPs to operate. | 28-Dec-09 22:49 |
| 4062 | Graham | Altme must be calling home regularly so that mum knows you're alive and not to release your name | 28-Dec-09 22:49 |
| 4061 | Carl | Explanation: worlds know your IP because you send it to SafeWorlds server every 5 mins. | 28-Dec-09 22:49 |
| 4060 | Graham | Pekr, does wireshark show any contact with the homeworld ..?? | 28-Dec-09 22:49 |
| 4059 | Pekr | don't tell me you can't ping 193.85.151.2 | 28-Dec-09 22:49 |
| 4058 | Carl | Yes, there is. | 28-Dec-09 22:48 |
| 4057 | Pekr | There is no such requirement in the docs! | 28-Dec-09 22:48 |
| 4056 | Pekr | Carl - what do you mean by "ping"? | 28-Dec-09 22:48 |
| 4055 | Graham | Pekr, your client is pinging safeworlds .. they're not pinging you! | 28-Dec-09 22:47 |
| 4054 | Pekr | Graham - if I would want a solution, I would pay few bucks for permanent registration and be done with it ... = noone would complain about apparent bug. | 28-Dec-09 22:47 |
| 4053 | Graham | Pekr doesn't want solutions .. he wants a perrmanent fix | 28-Dec-09 22:47 |
| 4052 | Pekr | I think, that altme.com stops pinging, or at some point mistakenly decides, that my worlds are not online for more than 10 days, and frees the names. That is the part I would try to look for the bug ... | 28-Dec-09 22:46 |
| 4051 | Carl | Xidys shows no server pings. | 28-Dec-09 22:46 |
| 4050 | Steeve | Wow i'ts cheating :-) | 28-Dec-09 22:46 |
| 4049 | Pekr | Graham - no, that requirement is not there, and should not be there. | 28-Dec-09 22:46 |
| 4048 | Graham | maybe all you need Pekr is a script that pings safeworlds on port 5500 | 28-Dec-09 22:45 |
| 4047 | Pekr | In one case, I also notice bug with backport connection from altme.com. I mean - when trying to start 2 servers on one machine. It registered second world on the same port .... but I don't remember it exactly ... | 28-Dec-09 22:45 |
| 4046 | Pekr | It ran OK ... my public IP is - 193.85.151.2 | 28-Dec-09 22:43 |
| 4045 | Pekr | It has to be open - I am right now on my own network. | 28-Dec-09 22:42 |
| 4044 | Carl | I can grep the log... 1 min. | 28-Dec-09 22:42 |
| 4043 | Pekr | everything enablet (outgouing) | 28-Dec-09 22:42 |
| 4042 | Carl | Try this in REBOL: close open tcp://www.safeworlds.com:5500 | 28-Dec-09 22:42 |
| 4041 | Pekr | I just don't know how to track it down. The only thing I can follow is docs, which state, that altme.com tries for 10 days ... but it is not the case. | 28-Dec-09 22:42 |
| 4040 | Carl | There are only two ways this can happen (that I can think of): 1. you have 5500 blocked (outgoing) 2. you are using AltServe (not AltME) and it does not ping (because it is commerical) | 28-Dec-09 22:41 |
| 4039 | Pekr | yes, I run 50 mikrotik routers, I know what I am doing :-) But - you say I need to open port 5500 INTO my network? | 28-Dec-09 22:40 |
| 4038 | Carl | If the Safeworlds server does not see the ping, then it cannot reset the timer on your world. | 28-Dec-09 22:40 |
| 4037 | Carl | Note that AltME when used as a server must be able to ping port 5500 at regular intervals. That's how Safeworlds keeps your world registered. | 28-Dec-09 22:39 |
| 4036 | Pekr | But I can guarantee, that the worlds are used. I was online the same day, and in few hours, worlds were not accessible, and altme.com/check stated world names being available. That should not happen. | 28-Dec-09 22:39 |
| 4035 | Carl | So, you use AltME for both server and client. | 28-Dec-09 22:38 |
| 4034 | Pekr | AltME only ... | 28-Dec-09 22:38 |
| 4033 | Carl | Pekr, are you using AltServe or AtlME? | 28-Dec-09 22:38 |
| 4032 | Graham | me too ... | 28-Dec-09 22:37 |
| 4031 | Graham | So it appears to be only an issue with unpaid worlds? | 28-Dec-09 22:37 |
| 4030 | Pekr | I am trying to track down a nasty bug, not a business model | 28-Dec-09 22:37 |
| 4029 | Pekr | Graham - no. | 28-Dec-09 22:37 |
| 4028 | Graham | Did you pay for your worlds Pekr? | 28-Dec-09 22:36 |
| 4027 | Pekr | There has to be some bug somewhere ... | 28-Dec-09 22:35 |
| 4026 | Pekr | yes, I run two worlds - Xidys, Vertuzo. It happened at least 5 times in last two years, that I lost world registration with no reason. Docs state, that we loose world registration, if world is not available to Safeworlds servers for 10 days. But it was not the case..... | 28-Dec-09 22:35 |
| 4025 | Carl | I don't understand... can you explain the problem? | 28-Dec-09 22:34 |
| 4024 | Pekr | the most bad bug of Altme is the occassional registration of World names. Last happened last week. It happens every 2-3 months ... | 28-Dec-09 22:32 |
| 4023 | Carl | Yes, a blend of AltME and IOS. | 28-Dec-09 22:31 |
| 4022 | Steeve | So in Altme 3.0, the community can build plugins | 28-Dec-09 22:29 |
| 4021 | Steeve | So, still under development, glad to hear that. | 28-Dec-09 22:26 |
| 4020 | Carl | Some info that I hope clarifies... 1. AltME is from Safeworlds, independent of REBOL Tech. 2. AltME is still being developed, but is waiting for R3. 3. AltME may be updated before R3. So, be sure to report bugs. 4. IOS was traded to Safeworlds. But, it may still be possible to get a trial release for users. 5. I use AltME quite often, but I must avoid lengthy conversations in order to get work done. 6. R3 Chat is a backend prototype for AltME 3.0 -- which in final form will be more like IOS (allow user-built reblets.) | 28-Dec-09 22:15 |
| 4019 | Graham | On IOS, it was the dreaded recycle bug .. here it is "internet busy ..." :( | 28-Dec-09 21:21 |
| 4018 | Henrik | AltME is sort of "replaced" by R3 chat on R3, in that Carl usually doesn't visit this place very often and prefers R3 chat. The practical implementation of R3 chat is different and the outcome makes it serve a different purpose than AltME. | 22-Dec-09 10:21 |
| 4017 | joannak | Well.. Since Reb2 don't have Unicode it would be really hard to do Unicode support into AltME .. After version 3, who knows.. Though I have to say that I have no idea of the AltME status. Earlier I though it belongs to some 3rd party company that just Used Rebol as a devtool. | 22-Dec-09 10:16 |
| 4016 | Steeve | i fear | 20-Dec-09 4:43 |
| 4015 | Steeve | Altme is not developped anymore | 20-Dec-09 4:42 |
| 4014 | Jerry | I hope AltME will support Unicode soon. I have a REBOL Chinese group, And I would like to move it here. | 20-Dec-09 4:23 |
| 4013 | Reichart | ...Or Moor's laziness? :) | 19-Dec-09 20:35 |
| 4012 | Sunanda | Public posts in the REBOL3 AltME world have just topped 125,000.....
http://www.rebol.org/aga-index.r
.....Add in non [web public] posts and the world is twice as large. Carl replaced the original REBOL AltME world because it had grown too large. And that was with just 80,000 posts in total. We may be seeing an application of Moor's Law here :) | 19-Dec-09 12:34 |
| 4011 | BrianH | A hidden legacy filesystem hierarchy with a user-friendly one overlaid on top. And the sensible one to use depends on what you want to do, but command line tools (like REBOL) can quite easily access both, if you know what you're doing. | 10-Dec-09 3:51 |
| 4010 | Maxim | more like OSX? in what way? | 10-Dec-09 3:14 |
| 4009 | BrianH | Maxim, the changes to Vista just make it work more like OS X and some Linux distributions. You can use similar methods to deal with the confusion to the ones that work on those platforms. | 10-Dec-09 2:07 |
| 4008 | BrianH | PeterWood, that distinction isn't between themed applications and non-themed - that distinction is unrelated. | 10-Dec-09 2:04 |
| 4007 | BrianH | Reichart, i agree with you, but that doesn't work with user-based security. That is application-based security, something that Windows doesn't support. You can argue with what the security model should have been, but that doesn't affect what is. | 10-Dec-09 2:03 |
| 4006 | PeterWood | From what I understand this is only a problem under Windows 7 for non-themed applications. Themed applications use a "virtual" location. (Perhaps some Windows expert can confirm this). I guess it is unlikely that AltME will be converted to a themed application. | 10-Dec-09 0:21 |
| 4005 | Reichart | I agree with Maxim... But will extend a concept, which is that there should also be a Shared space, for example, where a given application ALLOWs anyone (or specific other apps) to change the data. | 9-Dec-09 22:36 |
| 4004 | Maxim | to me the problem is that MS should have created a real application framework... actually, only Apple with OSX seems to be really close to this. there should be THREE root directories and only three dirs for each application. windows has dozens, which is crazy. 1. Application SOURCE data (.exe, libs, datafile, etc) 2. Application STORAGE data (game saves, defaults 3. Application Temporary data, flushed on program quit by the OS. within Storage, you'd have application and user-based storage and that's it. The os refuses to execute any file not within application source dir, so you have already clamped down on a lot of security issues. a list of approved .exe is stored whenever you launch an application for the first time. for a bit more flexibility, several application dirs could exist, so that you can do stuff like compile items and run them locally within your dev environment, but these dirs would be explicitely registered within the os. on install the Application should be required to ask permission (like flash) in how much space will be stored within STORAGE if it exceeds a max default, independently of SOURCE. The implementation of MyXxxx folders is completely horrendous, and should be a simple and ubiquitous form that has one entry for each media type, and a browser where you want to put your stuff (which might not be user-specific). IIRC this was addressed in Vista, but then they went and added aliases to everything, which raises errors in the explorer, cause you can't use them. They alias core windows directories in other languages, the result being that explorer and actual disk info are different! this completely fucks up many applications (like rebol). windows has a hard time "fixing" things... they always just patch it... its worse since they have a hard time starting with any good implementation of anything to begin with. | 9-Dec-09 20:57 |
| 4003 | AdrianS | You get into problems when companies dictate that pre-installed apps are on a read only partition, or there is a disk quota. | 9-Dec-09 20:33 |
| 4002 | Reichart | "The real problem is that no program in some directory under the Program Files directory should be putting its data files (or allowing writing) to the same directory as the program files." I don't agree with this. In fact, I vote that we have sandboxes (that are also folders), and a company can do what ever they want in their own sandbox. | 9-Dec-09 19:18 |
| 4001 | Gabriele | the problem is that windows sucks; the "don't write here" is ms's work around that. | 9-Dec-09 10:47 |
| 4000 | Graham | Giving myself write privgs on the altme directory has fixed the issue. Tiresome this. What exactly is the security problem with storing data with programs? | 9-Dec-09 9:35 |
| 3999 | BrianH | Of course, this is all a consequence of user-based security being kind of a bad idea in the first place. | 9-Dec-09 9:01 |
| 3998 | BrianH | As it is, Win7 (and to a lesser extent Vista) do exactly that kind of workaround for bad programs under Program Files, redirecting their data files to another ProgramFiles directory under local settings. It's tricky, but not as tricky as trying to make the programs secure otherwise. However, if you put your program directory somewhere where it can't figure out that aliasing, the system has to assume that you know what you are doing and you have to act accordingly and fix the permissions on the directory to match what you want to do. | 9-Dec-09 8:59 |
| 3997 | BrianH | The real problem is that no program in some directory under the Program Files directory should be putting its data files (or allowing writing) to the same directory as the program files. That's a Win9x thing, and insecure. If programs that are running outside of the system directories run with less privileges, then all the better. | 9-Dec-09 8:54 |
| 3996 | BrianH | Chrome works like AltME and works just fine with the Windows 2000 security model. It does this by putting the program and its files in the local settings directory, then checking it before running. MySpace IM used to do this to allow students to load the program onto half-locked-down computers at their schools without getting permission from the admins (I was one such admin, so this was annoying), but Chrome seems to be much less of a security hole. AltME could quite easily work the same way. | 9-Dec-09 8:51 |
| 3995 | Reichart | Wouldn't it be "more right" if Vista let the program be a portable application, and in fact supported this "correct" way of doing things? | 9-Dec-09 8:19 |
| 3994 | BrianH | Fix the permissions of the directory. AltME (like many REBOL programs) doesn't act like a proper Windows app, it acts like a portable app. It doesn't put its files in the right place for an installed Windows app. Vista and 7 are right to complain. | 9-Dec-09 7:27 |
| 3993 | amacleod | sounds as annoying as vista | 8-Dec-09 14:10 |
| 3992 | Graham | now if I don't run as admin, it says it can't write to the state file. | 8-Dec-09 11:35 |
| 3991 | Graham | I've moved to my new windows 7 laptop and have setup Altme in it's own directory at c:\altme | 8-Dec-09 11:35 |
| 3990 | Reichart | Carl has been finally getting around to attending to this world, things should start working again.... | 2-Dec-09 7:33 |
| 3989 | Mchean | possibly - that was a suprise | 1-Dec-09 17:04 |
| 3988 | Izkata | 6-May-2008, someone posted a bunch of Javascript asking about SQL injection code, could that be it? | 1-Dec-09 8:11 |
| 3987 | Henrik | There was discussion about a JS exploit a while ago. It could be in that file. | 1-Dec-09 7:38 |
| 3986 | Graham | JS ? | 1-Dec-09 6:30 |
| 3985 | Mchean | must be a false warning | 1-Dec-09 4:22 |
| 3984 | Mchean | file:C:\Altme\worlds\rebol3\chat\380.set->(SCRIPT0001) | 1-Dec-09 4:20 |
| 3983 | Mchean | strange - started up altme and ms anti virus reported a trojan virus | 1-Dec-09 4:20 |